City Of Heroes: Regen Scrapper Changes

Statesman has posted that when the data analysis has been done he will post more. I don't understand this. Surely, the origin of this change and severity of this change was based upon analysis already done?
I can't be sure without having the specific posts to hand, but I'd assume that what States is referring to is the analysis of the data from the Test Server with the current changes.

The devs don't make a balance change then move to the next thing - they put the changes on the Test Servers and gather data on the effects of the changes (and player feedback about them), then see if the changes are accomplishing what they intended. If not, they make adjustments and then gather more data. This process continues even after the changes have gone live, to check that they're working as intended and whether or not further adjustments need to be made. At the same, time, they're going through a similar process with many other balance issues.

What exactly can a regen scrapper do that:
a) they shouldn't be able to do?
b) no other scrapper can do?
c) no other AT can do?
I appreciate there have been some things passed on about this in answer to part (a) above though (b) and (c) have not been adequately responded to.
Well, in my view at least, b) and c) are largely irrelevant in most cases. Just because there are several balance problems in the game is no reason not to fix one of them. The others will be dealt with in time - in fact, the sooner one is fixed, the sooner they can focus on the next one.

Also, when it comes to c), just because one Archetype can do something, that doesn't mean there's no problem with another Archetype being able to do it. If, for example, a Defender can control groups of bad guys as well as a Controller, there's a problem.

Finally, I feel it's important to recognise that, especially when it comes to balance issues (as opposed to bugs), things are rarely as black and white as whether a specific AT or Powerset combination 'can' or 'can't' do something - how easily they can do something and with how much risk is just as important.

Even if other Scrappers can do everything that Regen can, if Regen can do those things significantly quicker, easier or with less risk, there's a balance problem.

Next, the only balance problems that have been described in any quantifiable way whatsoever are
a) being able to herd/arrest too many enemies
b) being able to solo AVs
Erm, to refer back to the post I made above:

Geko:
Quote:
it was not uncommon to survive a mission 3 levels higher than you built for 3 players
Statesman:
Quote:
Regen Scrappers handily survive missions set even at the toughest levels
Those are both pretty specific, quantifiable things. If Regen Scrappers can complete missions set to the highest difficulty with less risk than other Scrappers, that's a problem. And if Regen Scrappers can complete a mission set to the highest difficulty setting and spawned for a group, that's even more of a problem.

And once again, when it comes to balance, not everything can be broken down into specific, easily quantifiable examples. Regen was (and arguably still is, even with the current changes) all but unstoppable in PvP, even by other Scrappers. To go back to Statesman again:
I want the Scrapper secondaries to holistically be equal to one another. In other words, when solo, small team and large teams are taken to account, I want Regen to be as effective as the other secondaries. Admittedly, there will be times when one particular Power Set is circumstantially better - a particular Boss, AV, etc. - but when all the factors are considered, the Power Sets might act differently, but they're all equally capable.
This kind of balancing can involve dozens or evern hundreds of factors.

Now again some evidence/analysis would be welcomed.
I have to ask - is it that you think Cryptic is lying to us and doesn't have the data, or that you think that they're misunderstanding the data they have? My apologies if that sounds a little blunt or confrontational, but I'm genuinely curious why some people don't seem to trust Cryptic on this. What benefit is there to them in misleading us?

This leads me onto my next set of questions. What does the data analysis that has been conducted include? Have the different builds been considered e.g. with tough/weave and without, with and without perma-MoG? Also, another question based upon vested interest, have different primaries been segmented in the analysis? For example I don't think Claws would fare half as well as Katana.
Yes, a wide variety of builds are tested by Cryptic long before we ever see any changes on the Test Server - both Statesman and Geko have confirmed this several times, with reference to both the current Regen changes and previous balance adjustments to other aspects of the game.

In addition, as I mentioned in my reply to Ravenswing, this is one of the reasons that the Test Server and these boards exist - so that Cryptic can get hard data (from the servers) and feedback from players (from these boards) with all kinds of builds at all kinds of levels. It's also one of the reasons that they continue to monitor and analyse data and player feedback after a change goes live, and have proved in the past that they are perfectly willing to remove or alter changes that turn out not to have the desired results.

Again, what can we see of this analysis.
Again, I very much doubt that the data Cryptic uses could be posted due to practical reasons. And even if it could, I very much doubt that I for one would be able to understand it.

I appreciate this post may sound pissy, it isn't meant to, I am a little disheartened with this so far though.If you genuinely are going to pass these comments on to the devs then I would encourage others to add to my questions with anything pertinent I have missed.
As I said at the start, I'll be sure to pass these comments on. I've already highlighted this thread to Cryptic more than once, and I know that States reads these boards regularly.

However you sound, you're raising points that are important to you as a player of the game, and I know Cryptic values player feedback very highly, so thank you for taking the time to post.

And, in case I haven't made it clear, that applies to everyone who has offered constructive criticism and feedback in this thread and anywhere else on these boards. This stuff is important and it does help Cryptic continue to improve this game that we all love.

Here is that EU Thread